Ordinary People Extraordinary Things
Real Hope.
Real stories.
From everyday people, just like you.
🎙️ NEW podcast episode every other Sunday!
Ordinary People Extraordinary Things
102. From Jail Cell to Jesus: How Jamie Markley Found Grace After 20 Years Incarcerated
What does it take to truly change a life marked by decades of addiction and incarceration? For Jamie, it was an encounter with Jesus in the most unexpected place – a jail cell where she faced a potential 27-year sentence.
In this raw and powerful conversation, Jamie takes us through her journey of repeated imprisonment that began at age 24. After a divorce left her questioning her identity as both a wife and mother of five, she turned to substances to numb the pain, setting off a nearly 20-year cycle of addiction, incarceration, brief periods of sobriety, and inevitable return to old patterns.
The turning point came in 2015 when, labeled a "habitual criminal" by the courts, Jamie received a surprising visit from her estranged daughter who made a simple request: "Mom, if you start praying and reading the Bible, I'll come back to see you." That promise – and the relationship it represented – sparked something profound. Through tears on her cell floor, Jamie cried out to a God she didn't know, beginning a transformation that would ultimately break the cycle that had defined her life.
Jamie's story challenges our assumptions about redemption and rehabilitation. She offers unique insights into prison culture, the process of becoming "institutionalized," and the overwhelming challenges of reintegration into society.
Today, Jamie works in ministry, has rebuilt relationships with all five of her children, and carries a special heart for those still incarcerated. Her testimony stands as living proof of 2 Corinthians 5:17: "If anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come." Listen and discover how one person's belief – both human and divine – can change everything.
https://generationstogenerations.com/podcast
ordinarypeoplestories@gmail.com
https://www.facebook.com/ordinarypeoplestory
https://www.instagram.com/ordinarypeopleextraordinary/
X: @storiesextra
Any advice should be confirmed with a qualified professional.
All rights reserved: Ordinary People Extraordinary Things
Stories shared by guests may not always be shared views of OPET.
Being a guest does not mean OPET approves of every decision or action in the guests' life.
We all have a story, all of us, share your story. You don't have to have the perfect answer or the perfect life - share what Jesus is doing in your life. This is an easy, real way to witness & share your testimony.
Welcome to Ordinary People, extraordinary Things. I'm your host, nancy Bruscher, and I'm so glad you've joined us for our 102nd episode. You're in for a treat. Today I get to talk with Jamie, who shares how she met Jesus in a jail cell. After years of trying to break unhealthy habits on her own, everything changed when God miraculously turned her heart and her life around. Before we dive in, I want to say happy Mother's Day. I'm so thankful for my mom and that I get to be a mom to two amazing kids. If today is a joyful one for you, I'm celebrating with you. If today brings sadness, I'm praying for you. These kinds of days often stir up memories, and some of these memories you have on old home videos that you can't watch anymore because they're not in digital form. I'd love to help Go to generations2generationscom Generations is plural and two is T-O and stay tuned until the end of the episode for a special discount on video transfers. Let's get started.
Nancy Bruscher:Welcome to Ordinary People, Extraordinary Things. I'm here with Jamie. Jamie, thanks for being on. Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm excited. I'm so thankful that you decided to come and share your story with all of our listeners.
Jamie Markley:Yes, I don't want anyone to feel like they're alone in this.
Nancy Bruscher:So if people don't know who you are, what three words or phrases would you use to describe yourself?
Jamie Markley:The first one is understanding, also, lately, given the circumstances, curious and and very, very empathetic, so those are really good. Yeah, that's kind of the season I'm in. Are those three stood out when, when I thought about them, like these are the three that are the strongest right now.
Nancy Bruscher:I like how you bring up right now. I think that that's interesting. How maybe how you would describe yourself at different points in your life could change. Obviously yes, sometimes daily, right? Sure, yeah, so we get to talk about how you came to know Jesus in jail, absolutely yes, so that's just like throw it out there right?
Jamie Markley:Okay, Just grab this and tell me about it.
Nancy Bruscher:Maybe we should step back on what brought you to jail. How did you end up in jail and how old were you? Can you give us a little bit of that story?
Jamie Markley:I'll give you the background. So my going inside to jail for the first time was 2004, shortly followed by a divorce from about a nine year relationship. I had already had all five of my children by then, and you were how? Old 24. Once the divorce happened, I thought oh no, I'm not a mom right now, I'm not a wife. Who am I? What am I gonna do? Well, along came all these emotions that I started to numb with alcohol, drugs, chaos, a lot of confusion. So shortly followed, as usual, I went to jail and was given a two and a half year sentence for prison. So from jail to prison, I went in 2004.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, Honestly, I don't. What's the difference?
Jamie Markley:So jail is a county facility. Okay, so those are temporary sentences. The longest I think you can serve in jail in a county jail would be one year. Okay, anything additional is you get transferred to a state facility which is a prison.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, and what was your? What? Why were you in it? Thank you.
Jamie Markley:I was charged with burglary and trying to remember what else stuck, I think it burglary and possession of a firearm. Okay, I kind of remember what else stuck. I think it was burglary and possession of a firearm. Okay, per the divorce we went through mediation. I could either afford the house or just the utility, so the agreement was I would remove my belongings from the home while he was not at work and a friend of mine helped me remove those. The locks had been changed and I went through the doggy door to open the door and the neighbor didn't recognize the truck because I drove a minivan, couldn't load my things, so it was a borrowed truck and called the police. Given, I was so young I didn't know the law and I was charged with burglary.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, so this was your first sentence. Is that the right way to say it? Yep, Okay, so kind of like an odd that seems kind of weird.
Jamie Markley:The charge itself is bizarre, however, the behavior that led to it. It's just I was doing all kinds of things harming other people in the sense that offending them or invading their space or just not being aware of and this is all due to an addiction, you know.
Nancy Bruscher:You're saying if I was sober, if I was clean and I went through a doggy door, I probably wouldn't have had this problem. Right, right, okay, yes, I probably would have contacted law enforcement and said here's my paperwork.
Jamie Markley:here's the agreement. I'm supposed to enter the home now and remove my right, Right, Okay, Okay. I probably would have contacted law enforcement and said here's my paperwork.
Nancy Bruscher:Here's the agreement. I'm supposed to enter the home now and remove my belongings. Okay, absolutely yes, okay. So this was two and a half years, you said for Okay.
Jamie Markley:So I went into the prison facility in 2004, served that time very young, Put on a minimum or I mean a medium security yard. A lot of people were doing life. It was a crash course on some realities Between the jail and going to the prison. It was a little over three years. I was gone and released in 2006.
Nancy Bruscher:little over three years I was gone and released in 2006. So you said it was a crash, crash course, what in reality and what, what.
Jamie Markley:What do you? Well, you know the divorce and the house and the kids and these things. I've thought to myself at that point when that had happened, I had lost everything. I hadn't. You don't really lose everything until you lose your freedom to your identity, your right to make your own decisions. At that point I felt, wow, this is what losing everything really feels like. And then to see kind of the other culture, you see movies and you figure that prisons are ran this way and no, they're really not. Not, it's a really dark place. It's a very dark place, a lot of broken people. Yeah, yeah, so there was some realities and you have to look at yourself. Right, you have a lot of time to think and what's something different than we see in a movie um.
Jamie Markley:So for females, I believe the incarceration is a completely different experience. It's not as much violence or gang ran as, say, the males would run theirs, because females are nurturing right. They tend to connect to one another in whatever unhealthy way that might be, so maybe not as much segregation, so it's not like that. But the food is horrible and the company's all over the place, yeah, and it's corrupt as well.
Nancy Bruscher:Sure. So in 2006, you got out and then you were 26? Yep, 26 going on 27.
Jamie Markley:Okay, and I'm home for about a year, find myself back in addiction. So I'm trying to just operate off just sobriety and kind of find my way, and I've been a stay-at-home mom now since I was 17. Now I've been incarcerated, divorced, so I'm trying to incorporate some kind of success in life skills of sobriety alone, which unfortunately was very short-lived at that point and ended up with another prison sentence in 2007. Do you mind sharing what that was? I'm trying to remember what this one was.
Nancy Bruscher:I guess it doesn't matter.
Jamie Markley:These were all drug-related charges.
Nancy Bruscher:Yes, absolutely.
Jamie Markley:Okay, May have been evading law enforcement. May have been the actual charge.
Nancy Bruscher:But it all kind of stems from a drug addiction.
Jamie Markley:It's all addiction-related. Never any violence towards anyone. Just trying to get away with what I could to feed the addiction right, yeah. Along with that comes a lot of chaos and a lot of illegal behavior.
Nancy Bruscher:Were you sober in prison? Yes, Okay, yes, I didn't know if that was a time of well, you can still get away with getting this and this and you can.
Jamie Markley:It's very prevalent, it just for me, it just wasn't something I was interested in. Once I got in there, I really kind of wanted to be alert and aware of my surroundings. So anything to diminish that felt very unsafe. So 2007, I was given a five-year sentence oh wow, and went into a maximum security yard this time.
Jamie Markley:Oh wow, another different culture there. You don't ask people how much time they have. It's highly offensive. Some have 200 plus years. A lot are not leaving, they don't have release dates and they don't want to hear about yours. It's offensive. So more life lessons. I actually tried to pick up some trade skills and stuff during this sentence, and so I was a teacher's assistant and I helped with that, and I worked for motor vehicle department, which is answering the phones and so you answer the phones like people.
Nancy Bruscher:I'm gonna I don't know if I'm using the right words like outside would call and they might get you so in the state of Arizona all those phone calls are routed to an inmate first.
Jamie Markley:Oh wow, you call those numbers and you get an inmate. If personal information is to be exchanged, we then transfer them to the next level operator, who will obviously has access and can be cleared for security to do so Okay, oh, very interesting.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, so you had five years, you're trying to get some skills. Did you do all five years or was it reduced?
Jamie Markley:So it's 85% of that. I think I was about four months shy of a total of five years. Wow. So cause you're sitting in jail and you're waiting for sentencing, and so you're gone. At that point as as well, sometimes they give you the credit for the days you sit in jail could be six months, could be nine months, could be a couple weeks, and so, um yep, almost five years wow, how do you survive that this we're already talking of of several years?
Nancy Bruscher:how, how did survive that? How did you keep going day by day?
Jamie Markley:You know, you figure, the alternative is what To not? I mean those are our choices.
Jamie Markley:Not every day is easy, but so many people in there, a lot of women in there, hearing their stories, seeing where they come from, is so much worse than what I had seen or been through. I felt at the time and so it kind of put a little context into you're just being irresponsible. These people actually have some real deep traumas. You just build a little family in there, you actually become quite connected with you. Just build a little family in there, you actually become quite connected with. I've met some of my best friends. I still have to this very day on the inside. A lot of people just make one bad choice. For some it's a whole lifestyle. I was young, still saw lots ahead, so at this point I'm not even 30 yet.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, you know, and there is a release date right there, Right, so there is that opportunity to try again to do something different. Okay so, and now I'm thinking well, I've got five years sobriety behind me, so definitely this must be it. Then.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah.
Jamie Markley:Because I've been gone a long time.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah, okay, so you're released in 2011. Okay, you're better at math than me.
Jamie Markley:Well, my cat might be off sometimes, so I'm going to. Yeah, we're estimating here, but it was 2011. Don't text us saying that was off by three months and now you're on parole and you've got these stipulations. You must do this and you must do this. So this is employment, housing, classes, fees, and so you're up against these things. And a lot of people come home. They don't have an identification card, they don't have job skills. A lot of their family, if you're gone a while or have offended them right, or your crime is against them, they don't want you to come home, sure? So these are all obstacles you face. Anything overwhelming in it for an addict can be just. The sky is blue and I have to check in with PO today and off and running you go. I mean, these things happen before you realize they're happening. You're just in it.
Nancy Bruscher:And you are you talking about that, and then your sobriety is gone again. It's just okay.
Jamie Markley:You think, okay, well, I'm just gonna go and have a drink or I'm just gonna go and see my old friend from back then and let him see I'm doing well and can I help him. And next thing you know you're right in the same boat you were and you're looking at another sentence.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, so 2011,. You got out. You weren't able to stay sober very long.
Jamie Markley:I think I had almost about nine months at that point. Okay, still trying to learn job skills, don't have transportation. So these are my goals that I've been thinking of for five years. I want to do this and this and this, and once you forget are the little details that go into that. How are you going to get to work? How are you going to go and check in? Where are you going to stay? How are you going to pay those fees, because if they're not paid, you go back in. It's a violation. And so these are all challenges you face, and there are answers for each and every one. Sometimes it's hard to ask for that help, though, or to know what questions to ask to get that help. So, about nine months, clean, and find myself out there and using once again, and a good friend of mine, his father, overdosed one night and the next morning I was arrested. I was still on supervision at this point, and so I had violated my parole and went back in for yet another sentence.
Jamie Markley:Oh wow, yeah, so these are just examples.
Nancy Bruscher:So probably like 2012, maybe 2012. These are just examples, so probably like 2012, maybe 2012.
Jamie Markley:These are short sentences. This was a parole violation so I went in for I'm going to say about 9, 10 months on that one.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, so then you were clean again for that 9, 10 months. Yep, okay, yep.
Jamie Markley:And I'm thinking, okay, this has got to stop, but released this time. Now I have no supervision. The parole has ended while I'm in prison, so I'm finishing my parole in prison because I had violated, Okay. Okay, so now I get out and I don't have all these stipulations and get into yet another unhealthy relationship surrounded by addiction and codependency. And this is what I know now guilt from not being with the kids, the family face another short sentence 2013. Okay, and that was how long this one was? About a year and a half.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, and all still kind of to do with drugs and Yep, all addiction, yeah, all addiction, and it's worth mentioning that.
Jamie Markley:The constant that I didn't see at the time. And now, looking back, I kept going right back to the same neighborhood, the same people trying to do something different with all the same things. So right Definition of insanity. I didn't even try sobriety at that point. Once I was released, I just kind of threw my hands up and said I'm in it now Okay, yeah, I mean honestly at some point.
Nancy Bruscher:That's what I'm thinking is do you just give up on sobriety, because yeah, what's the point now?
Jamie Markley:I'm just going to go bigger and make money and meet the top people, and which comes with bigger consequences. Right, we're not thinking of that yet. So I'm home not even a year, and looking at another sentence Okay, and so that's 2015.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay.
Jamie Markley:By this point, I don't even know how many felonies are out there. My record's quite extensive. At this point, I'm doing anything I can to avoid law enforcement. I had moved out of state. Come back, you name it. So 2015 I get arrested Again, and this one I do remember, given it's the last one. I had Tylenol 3s, which is a narcotic without a prescription, and a slew of other charges that gets reduced down to that, but given my background, I ended up with a nine-year sentence.
Nancy Bruscher:Nine years, because is there and you're going to maybe see my being so naive but is there a three strikes and you're out, not for Arizona, what is that?
Jamie Markley:Yeah, so actually during ironically enough, during sentencing on this last sentence in 2015, the judge actually did say verbatim at this point, the court system considers you a habitual criminal, the court system considers you a habitual criminal, and I just remember those words hitting me so hard, like this is what I am, this is where I'm at, and at that point, the sentence that was being threatened was 27 years. Because of not the violence of the crime or what the crimes were themselves, but because of the consistency of you're going back in, you're going back in, you're going back in, you're going back in, and nothing had changed. They'd given me many chances. Truly, they had no three strikes in Arizona.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, california, yes, I've kind of heard that, so I was wondering what that meant, or if it was even real, I guess. It is.
Jamie Markley:It is. Each state varies with their sentencing laws and their you know.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, okay, so this was 2015. It was possibly 27 years. It got knocked down to nine.
Jamie Markley:Yes, okay, this is where things start changing. Yay, thank you, jesus. So 2015, I go into jail. I'm not even sure what charges are out there, nor do I care.
Nancy Bruscher:Sorry, how old are you at this point? Oh boy, let's see, you were 24 in 2004, so 35?, 35, there you go, yes, yes, hey, good job, Yay math.
Jamie Markley:So, yes, at 35 years old, at this point, I don't really have a relationship with the kids. I've been there, been gone, been there, been gone. My family's just like this is just what you do. Anything, any promises I have or feelings are just. They're not valid at this point. They've heard it all as far as family goes, just like tough love. As far as I go, I just don't see a way out of this. I just think that this is just my lot in life. This is what I know, 2015,. I go into jail, pretty broken, pretty lost, thinking I'm gonna serve 27 years. So the public defender comes in and says you have 48 hours to sign this plea agreement, serve 27 years. So the public defender comes in and says you have 48 hours to sign this plea agreement for 27 years, or we go to trial, meaning who knows what happens, right? So I get back to my jail cell and I tell them walk me down. I'm trying to wrap my head around. Okay, 27 years, it's possible I die in prison at this point.
Nancy Bruscher:Right, that's about I mean roughly you'd be, about 65.
Jamie Markley:Who knows right.
Nancy Bruscher:Who knows?
Jamie Markley:what health issues you come up against or, at that point, the majority of your life has been spent inside, which I've become quite accustomed to and learned how to navigate inside and become successful inside, if that makes sense. So I'm able to get better jobs and I know I know the population now, like they know who I am and is it in a way, easier to navigate?
Nancy Bruscher:That might be a dumb question.
Jamie Markley:It is so you're used to the chaos in addiction. Everything in your life is chaos, right? So that becomes an addiction in itself. The chaos and going inside where everything's just chaotic, you never know what's happening, that's a familiar state and so, yeah, it becomes really simple to navigate. Sure.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah, absolutely, that's really interesting.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, yeah, and you don't. You know, you just think that this is, the laws are ridiculous, or it's you against law enforcement, and so this is the mentality you go in there with. And that's the mentality you go in there with, and that's the mentality that's in there, you know, like us against them, when in fact the reality is no, it's you against yourself.
Nancy Bruscher:Right, that's profound yeah.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, so 2015,. I locked myself down in this little tiny cell and I'm thinking now, what? How did I get here? What is happening? What does this look like? Can I do 27 years? And if I can't, what's the alternative?
Jamie Markley:Right, so slowly, my parents start coming for visits as I'm waiting for the court system to process me, sentence me, and I'm like, oh, my parents. But I'm seeing them through this plexiglass and I'm like, wow, they're getting older. Oh, my gosh, they have health issues. What am I doing? So this weight of the guilt of everything, just just everything, is really heavy and I'm like, wow, how do you even begin to process something like that?
Jamie Markley:So I'm laying in my jail cell, which I didn't leave, often kind of in a depression and just a real dark place. My name gets called. I'm like my parents already came for my visit this week. So I get up and I go and I sit down and look once again and here's my oldest daughter, who I hadn't seen in years at this point and all this stuff. I'd been numb for so long. Then I looked at her and I just, you know, here, they all come flooding out and she visits to tell me that she's going active duty military and she's leaving Arizona. She was told that I was in jail and she just wanted to come and see me see how I am. And I was so excited and just in shock. Before she left she said Mom, if you start praying and reading the Bible, I'll come back to see you. I said, of course I will Right Anything to see my kid, sure. So now I'm seeing my parents are coming, my child is coming. Is there a light at the end of this tunnel? Right.
Jamie Markley:So now I have a glimmer of what I think is hope. So I get back to my cell and I'm excited. I'm on this adrenaline rush of oh my daughter loves me still.
Jamie Markley:And then I think, oh my gosh, I just made her a promise, I can't lie. So there in that jail cell I hit my knees doing the ugly, cry, crying and praying to a God I don't know, I know nothing about, I have no idea what it means. And I start to read this big, thick Bible and I have no idea what the context is. Here, About a month later, she's visiting. My parents are coming.
Nancy Bruscher:So she did come back to visit. She did. Was she on active duty? Did she get?
Jamie Markley:I think she came back or we were doing phone calls, okay, okay. Don't quote me.
Jamie Markley:Some things are still cloudy, that's fine. No, we continued through phones, letters, that type of thing, to have contact. Yeah, my parents were coming. I had one friend that was coming consistently, which these are things I never had in any previous sentence. I just kind of flew through it, solo Very limited communications, which was fine. Sometimes it's easier to do that. Then church is coming, right, they're coming in and they're doing services. I'm like, well, maybe if I go I'll get a better understanding of this. There's got to be something to it. So you are reading the Bible.
Nancy Bruscher:I am. I don't know what it means. Yeah.
Jamie Markley:I don't have the context, the story. There's definitely not a huge following in there at this point. Like who do I go and ask? Yeah, sure.
Jamie Markley:I start going to church that's coming in and doing services. About a month later I get another visit from the attorney and he says listen, I have one plea, it's a nine-year sentence. It was three charges 2.5 stacked on top of 2.5 stacked on top of 4.5, to total nine years. I said where do I sign? Let's do this, Get me out of here, let's start the sentence. And we did so. 27 years to nine years I thought was fabulous.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah. Is there a reason? Or do you think that's just one of God's little miracles, or you?
Jamie Markley:know I can tell you after the first night that I prayed. I had voluntarily locked myself down. I just wanted to be segregated. I didn't want to deal with anyone. I couldn't wrap my head around that. 27 years I thought I was facing. And the next morning I decided you know what? I'm going to get out of my bed today and I'm just going to have hope. I'm just going to try. If it's 27 years, that's fine. Maybe they'll learn from my mistakes. My kids will you know. Maybe I can find some forgiveness, some kind of direction here. So little did I know that was him working already right.
Jamie Markley:So I walk out of the cell and I'm looking around the jail and there must be, I would say, over 100 women housed in that small area. And I'm looking around and I'm thinking I had such love for each and every one. It was like I could see them, their pains and their hurts, and their moms right, and their daughters and their sisters. They're somebody to somebody and I just wanted to help, like I just wanted to help. I can't even explain it. Then, shortly, I had that visit with the attorney. Well, this is what we're actually looking at now. So, yeah, I was excited. There was some hope, there was some light at the end of the tunnel and I'm thinking this must be the Lord. Is this what everybody's talks about? Mm-hmm, what's happening? And so I entered that sentence for the first time out of all five of them, with hope, confidence, like just love, like I had a love. I wasn't numb, I wasn't just, like you know.
Nancy Bruscher:That's so interesting. So you went to church in jail and kept reading. What did these nine years look like for you in jail? I went in. I'm sorry.
Jamie Markley:No, that's okay, it's incarceration.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, I'll just throw them together, possibly, I don't expect people to just know Thank goodness.
Jamie Markley:So I went in and I already know the routine. You're gonna get placed here. You gotta find your job. You hope you get a good roommate like this is just what it is. So they put me in the state mandated classes and I end up getting a pretty good job. Two years in, they review my case again not my charges, but my prison case file and I'm sent down to minimum security for the first time in any sentence and I'm like which are better jobs, more opportunities, a little more freedom. I'm taking these classes, I'm going to some support groups, I'm still attending church. The Bible's making sense, I'm building a relationship with him, diving into self and just really looking at some things, and some generational things come up and starting to heal, which is painful. Right, get this good job and the next five years.
Nancy Bruscher:What is a job that you get? What's a good job?
Jamie Markley:So the first one I got is a printing factory. So they run printing presses and we print oh my gosh, we print stuff for some of the state facilities, county facilities, the log books, you name it.
Jamie Markley:Oh, okay, we print business cards, so that was something that was really neat. Okay, it seemed like every job that I had gotten in there I would end up being a lead. I would just catch on really quick, which helps to build your confidence skill sets, knowledge, friends, community and then you can help others, and when you're training somebody else, that feeling feels good too. Right, help. Somebody worked at the print shop for about three years, I think. It was ended up at a garment shop, became one of the people that ran that as well, and what that was is we made all the undergarments for all the prison systems.
Jamie Markley:there's the males and the females you know which is a whole another factory, and I did that for the rest of the males and the females, which is a whole other factory, and I did that for the rest of the sentence. So the remainder would have been another three.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, yeah, so you get out when you're about 44?.
Jamie Markley:I was 41.
Nancy Bruscher:Oh sorry, no, that's okay 41.
Jamie Markley:41. And I'm kind of guesstimating too, so we'll just roll with this.
Jamie Markley:Okay's okay. 41., 41. And I'm kind of guesstimating too, so we'll just roll with this, okay, great 41 sounds great, so you finally get out.
Jamie Markley:I do Now. I've built relationships too right.
Nancy Bruscher:Inside and out. Yes, okay, and what year is this?
Jamie Markley:So this is 2022.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay so not very long ago. No. What has life been like, do you say on the outside? Is that?
Jamie Markley:Oh boy, so 2022, given that I had actually done some work on myself. I've built a community, gained some knowledge, some skills. I didn't go back to the same place with the same people. Yay, I went to a different place and started on my own and had actually saved some money for the release, started working on my credit and my fines while I was still inside. Now I'm gaining these life skills right that I've been trying to learn for so long on my own. So I'm released and I go to a different place and I get a really nice job in a small little ranch town and doing great.
Jamie Markley:My parents are about two hours away at this point. Both of my dad's been fighting cancer for about seven years. By this time. My mom's got COPD On my. I'm driving that two hours to see them to do their grocery shopping or pick up their meds those types of things. I'm home for about four months and my mom calls and she says hey, we need you home now. Okay, she said it's time. So while I was gone, we had had the conversation. I have two brothers. I'm the only girl. I'm going to be their caretaker. You know, it's just where we're all comfortable with that decision and of course I agreed their health had declined quite a bit since I had gotten home, and so that night I packed up what little belongings I had into my car and I moved back to that same little town, to the same little house. Within two months my parents were both home on hospice, so I took care of both of them for about eight months. Dad passed May of 23, mom passed July of 23.
Nancy Bruscher:Oh wow, Were you able to stay sober during all this? No.
Jamie Markley:I had started drinking, okay, actually.
Nancy Bruscher:I was going to say now you're back to that spot. Yes, and this is a lot of emotions, right?
Jamie Markley:Sure, yeah, and honor, very fulfilling, very healing. I got to help them. They got their final wishes carried out as well, as I still don't know how to use tap to pay right or Apple Pay, or you know. So I'm still navigating all these things and I remember taking my mom her meds one night and she says are you drinking every night? And it dawned on me this had been going on for about two weeks and I thought to myself oh my gosh, I am. So that stopped real quick. I thought, oh no, we're not doing this.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay, so you had started drinking. You hadn't gotten to the drugs, though. Oh, no, no, no. Okay, but just like kind of drinking, and then, oh man, this could become a. Yeah, I didn't even realize it was daily at that point.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, Turning into a nurse and a caretaker pretty much overnight. I was kind of on autopilot and set a lot of the emotional aside. Emotions at that point are still kind of hard to identify and process because you know I had been numb for so many years. And so on the inside, yes, yes, I start to feel things, and things aren't as cloudy, but they're still hard to identify. Yeah, sure, so. So they pass September. So my older brother's, incarcerated at that point as well, had been gone for about seven, eight years I think, and his release was coming up September 1st, and so that's another reality. He had just lost our mom too, but he was gone. So I picked him up. I ended up leaving that town and moving back to the one I was at when I was released in Muscat, arizona, which is where my brother was as well. We kind of got to navigate some of that together.
Nancy Bruscher:And that was a good thing.
Jamie Markley:Oh my gosh so helpful.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, I love my brother.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah, well, one thing that you said before we started I thought this was really profound is you talked about how the military kind of like breaks you down to build you back up to what they want. And maybe people would say they don't agree, but I think that's somewhat of what people think of when they think of the military, and you said that that's kind of the way that the, the prison system was, is they? They tear you down but then they don't really help you get another identity. Is that what you said, or could you?
Jamie Markley:yeah, I can elaborate on that. So I think so for the military they do, right. They strip you down, they put you in the same clothing, you go through the same regiment, but they're building soldiers and you're picking up team skills, life skills, and you have a purpose, like they have an end goal for you. In the prison system, you're stripped of all your individualism, right. You don't even have a first name anymore. You're now just your prison number or your last name. That's it. Oh wow, I did not know that.
Jamie Markley:And your outfit looks like her outfit and her outfit and her outfit, right, Uh-huh. Okay, so you're. It's kind of I don't know if I want to use the word warehousing, but kind of.
Nancy Bruscher:Okay.
Jamie Markley:You know, everybody's kind of on the same scale, same level. You're all inmates, right, and yes, they offer programs, but truly it's on you to make those changes. There's some that are mandatory, yes, as they should be, but like anything else, you get out of what you put into and given a lot of them are ran by other inmates. Who's leading who? Yeah, yeah. So the rehabilitation, the self-awareness, the community, the socializing, that's up to you to learn, for you to correct, and not everybody wants to do that, not everybody wants to accept their responsibility of the choices they made and how it affected people and the ripple effects of and that's not even the hardest part. The hardest part is having a new identity in Christ, right. How do you take that outside with you? Having a new identity in Christ, right, how do you take that outside with you? How do you walk that out?
Nancy Bruscher:We were talking also about you become institutionalized. I think that's a word that's used, isn't it? It is Okay, yeah, and can you explain what it means, maybe specifically for you?
Jamie Markley:Oh my gosh. Institutionalized, yes, so for me, I can tell you a comical one real quick, Okay, so in there you are. A lot of these are common areas you share with hundreds of other people, so you can imagine the germs and everything else that's entailed with that. So you wear your what we call shower shoes into the shower so that your bare feet aren't touching water. Whoever did whatever, I went home and got in the shower and had mine on, and my mom was quite offended.
Jamie Markley:I cleaned that tub and I'm like, oh my goodness, I can't believe I did that. Sure.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, so institutionalized you become, you're routine-based. You get up at the same time, you eat at the same time, you get up at the same time, you eat at the same time, you work at the same time, you're closing your door at the same time, your phone calls are at the same time, you're waiting in line, you're asking permissions. It's very regimented. You're very routine based and what happens is it gets harder to deal with change choices. I I remember coming home, one of the first stops I made. Obviously, when you come home, you need those essentials, right, your hygiene, these everyday things. And I went into Walmart and there's at least a hundred different shampoos and I just was so overwhelmed in having to make a choice, like I don't know how to. How do you choose? Do I want you know? Right, it's sensory overload getting in a moving vehicle, the motion sickness, the different smells.
Nancy Bruscher:What is the change that stopped the recidivism, that stopped the just going back to the drugs? Was it God and community? Can you share what you think that was?
Jamie Markley:I think the integral part obviously was, of course, it was God, absolutely. Did I know at the time? No, I didn't know what that looked like Salvation, redemption, restoration I didn't even know what these meant, let alone to walk out. It was definitely him and forgiveness. So a lot of guilt. I carried a lot of guilt and being able to help my parents was very fulfilling and a lot of forgiveness came with that, with my family. And, honestly, the other part was it only took one person to believe in me, and that was my daughter. One person to say I believe in you. So, coming home to a community and I'm not denying that my charges or my actions at this point I've accepted responsibility for them. I've really recognized a lot of things. I'm aware of those things and I can spot them when they're coming the same behaviors or the same feeling I get when I was in a certain situation, and so I can make other choices.
Jamie Markley:I've been equipped and given tools to do so yeah, that's good.
Nancy Bruscher:I love that. One person believed that's it took one person.
Jamie Markley:That was it. Wow, yeah, well, two.
Nancy Bruscher:He's amazing, right yeah yeah, to say that he can redeem, and then to actually see that you have to want it.
Jamie Markley:I know there's a lot of misgivings. Forgiveness, redemption that type of thing is like an overnight and it's miraculous and everything's healed and you feel better because you're a child of God. And that's not the reality. After being away from certain relationships and society right. After being away from certain relationships and society right for a little less than 20 years, there's a lot of bridging those gaps. The main thing is getting used to asking for help. You can't do it by yourself.
Nancy Bruscher:Community's huge. This is good. This is so good. I feel like I'm talking too much. No, you're not. If you could kind of share where you are, we're in Colorado, obviously. If anyone doesn't know, we're in Colorado, so we're not in Arizona, so you've switched places. Yeah, and could you just kind of briefly tell us where you are as far as maybe your walk with God, your kids, sure A little bit about your life right now, 2024.
Jamie Markley:At this point last year, I was, like I said, living in Prescott. My brother lived with me and we were getting ready to go our separate ways, and my daughter and I had been talking while I was gone. You know, it would be great to live in the same state because we'd been rebuilding this relationship for years. And my oldest son too, right, he's in Colorado. She's in Colorado, my granddaughter's in Colorado, and I'm thinking, well, my parents are gone, what's to hold me here? Right? So I relocated to Colorado from Arizona in May of 24. So beautiful to be with my kids for the first time in how long, right? So? And my granddaughter, wow, what a blessing that is. So I moved here and I guess I had kind of put myself in a little box of. This is the manual labor jobs that I'm gonna apply for, because that's what I've always done. These are the things I've learned. Sure, and door after door after door was shut, and I thought, well, I was starting to get discouraged, but I knew where to turn to right.
Nancy Bruscher:Not to the drugs this time.
Jamie Markley:No, no, no, absolutely not Just in prayer. My daughter says, Mom, this church you've been attending, they have a position open. I said in my mind. I'm thinking, yeah right, who's going to take a felon on, right, right? I thought, oh heck, let's just try it. So I muddled through this technology aspect of applying for positions, which is also difficult, and did so and kind of forgot about it and kept applying. Next thing, you know, I'm going through interviews and got the position and so I actually am walking out ministry with a huge community in a church setting.
Nancy Bruscher:So, yeah. I love it and you've rebuilt relationships with two of your kids, yeah, actually all five.
Jamie Markley:Oh, I other two all five oh, I'm sorry, five I'm sorry, yeah, more so. I communicate with all five, everybody's at a different um space of bonding forgiveness relationship, but everybody's willing. So November of this I actually we all flew to Texas where my second daughter's at, and it was the first time I was in the same room with all five kids since 2012. Wow, interesting. And they're all grown now Like ah, wow, yeah.
Nancy Bruscher:That's even so redemptive in itself.
Jamie Markley:It was that moment I had been wanting for gosh almost 20 years, but to be present in it, you know. Not to be there and say, yeah, I spent the week with them or I went to a soccer game. No, I was there and I was present and able to be there and be present and accept whatever was coming, whether it was anger or understanding or questions, or regardless. Yeah, and just opening that door to where do you guys want to go from here? And it's your choice.
Nancy Bruscher:And God, because of your story, has given you a heart for those that are incarcerated is that right?
Jamie Markley:yeah, absolutely so. It is a mission field right of the broken and the forgotten, often forgotten, and it's huge because we think, well, our outreach is only the church or a mission field overseas. No, they're right here. It can be your neighbor, it can be a friend, it can be somebody in the grocery store. We just never know what people are going through and that isolated feeling of being incarcerated. And when you come home you're still somewhat isolated in your mind because you feel like you're different. You feel like you're wearing a neon shirt that says recently incarcerated. I don't know, sure. And so how do you, how do you reintegrate? What does that look like and what kind of help do you ask for? So I think those are spaces we need to step into more.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah Well, I'm excited to see where God brings you in that.
Jamie Markley:Yeah, I am too, actually. Yeah, colorado is very supportive in this whole field. We've done a lot of research and they're amazing in the state of Colorado to do these things. There are so many programs out there, so many.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah Well, good, I'll be excited to see where God leads you in that. Yeah, thanks, nancy, I appreciate it Well, as we wrap up, I'm sure people are going to have more questions, but we're going to have to wrap up for today. What is your favorite Bible verse or story?
Jamie Markley:2 Corinthians 5.17. Therefore, if anybody is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away.
Nancy Bruscher:Behold the new has has come.
Jamie Markley:That's a good one yeah, it's true, it's really good, it's real. So, yeah, he's the answer, for sure, and because of grace, all we have to do is ask right, that's amazing, yeah what are you grateful for oh?
Jamie Markley:my goodness, so many things Forgiveness and his, him walking alongside me, the strength to even walk through restoration. I am so grateful for my daughter saying I believe in you, and I can't even tell you the hundreds of people that have supported me in the last three years since I've been home. I am just grateful for the opportunity, regardless what those opportunities are, just the opportunity.
Nancy Bruscher:What kindness have you seen? Or what kindness have you shown? In the last week.
Jamie Markley:Oh my gosh, the kindness I've shown. Well, I'll tell you, it seems as if people can just identify if your stories are similar. So I'm going to say that it's a two-way street on the kindness They've listened, connected, and then I was able to tell them how I got where I'm at now, from where they are now, which is where I was at three years ago.
Jamie Markley:So the kindness is the connection, the honesty, and I can't believe I'm able to minister to other people. What a blessing. Yeah, that's huge. I think that's just kindness right there. Acceptance, acceptance, you know, yeah.
Nancy Bruscher:Well, I love you sharing your story and being not ashamed to share it. So thank you for just being honest and sharing your story. And for those people who are listening, who don't have any idea what jail or prison looks like, I'm so thankful. But I hope that they might see something as far as how change can actually happen, and I think all of us can need or want change somehow in our life.
Nancy Bruscher:And then again, I just keep on saying how the Bible is so real, about how it says you're a new creation, how it says all of these things you're like, but how, I mean, we kind of took quite a bit of time going through all of your times in jail or prison, and I think that that was actually good, because for me, even I started to be, uh, I don't think there's a way out, right and I, and so if, if you are kind of going through that with us of, ok, this is a lot. I hope that it was, because Otherwise we don't get to see the other side. If you just kind of like throw out numbers real quick, actually what had to change and like how, how God and one person walking with you was what was it? What you needed, it wasn't, you know. You tried all these other things and it and it didn't work. So I'm just amazed at how the Bible is true and through your story we get to see another aspect of how it is.
Jamie Markley:Yes, yes, he is the healer. This is the truth.
Nancy Bruscher:Well. Thank you for sharing. Thank you for listening on Ordinary People, extraordinary Things. Your story is His glory. What an amazing story of how God continues to change lives. As promised, if you have old home videos that need to be transferred to digital, head over to generations2generationscom. Under the home video tab you'll see a pop-up that says digitize your home videos, preserve your memories by 10 video transfers. Get the 11th on us. That's right. When you transfer 10 home videos, the 11th is free. It's a great way to relive and preserve your favorite memories for years to come. I'll see you in two weeks for a brand new episode with Jennifer Dukes Lee.