Ordinary People Extraordinary Things
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Ordinary People Extraordinary Things
103. When God Pursues You Even Through Your Deepest Doubts with Jennifer Dukes Lee
What happens when a skeptical news reporter becomes a passionate advocate for faith? Jennifer Dukes Lee's extraordinary journey from doubt to dedication reveals how persistent questioning can lead to profound belief.
Jennifer opens up about her background as a journalist who interrogated presidential candidates with the same rigor she later applied to scripture. With refreshing honesty, she admits she doesn't have a neat conversion story—just a gradual awakening to God's persistent pursuit. "Even when I didn't believe in God, He believed in me," she reflects, capturing the essence of a faith journey many listeners will recognize in their own lives.
The conversation takes a turn when Jennifer shares the never-before-told story of being trapped in her wrecked car during a blizzard. A stranger in a long skirt stood for what seemed like eternity, holding a quilt against Jennifer's broken window to block the freezing wind—a living metaphor for Christ's sacrificial love that Jennifer still carries with her today.
For anyone navigating doubts or wondering if their ordinary life matters, Jennifer's story offers profound reassurance. The questions that once threatened her faith became the very path that led her to Christ. Her testimony reminds us that in a culture obsessed with the spectacular, quiet faithfulness on ordinary days is indeed holy ground.
See the complete interview ⬇️
https://youtu.be/g6i0GSk-8b8
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https://jenniferdukeslee.com/
https://generationstogenerations.com/podcast
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We all have a story, all of us, share your story. You don't have to have the perfect answer or the perfect life - share what Jesus is doing in your life. This is an easy, real way to witness & share your testimony.
Welcome to Ordinary People Extraordinary Things. I'm so glad that you joined us. I'm your host, nancy Brusher. It's Memorial Day weekend and the beginning of summer. Our homeschool year ended a week ago and the summer for us is a great time to relax but also catch up on different things that we don't get to during the school year. On Friday, I got to speak to a group about did I hear God wrong? I've enjoyed growing in this area and sharing more in depth about God and my story. Today we'll hear from Jennifer Duxley, and she shares a story that she's never shared on a podcast before let's get started. Welcome to Ordinary People, extraordinary Things. I'm here with Jennifer. Jennifer, thanks for being on the show.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:It's really fun to be here.
Nancy Bruscher:Thanks for having me and you're coming to us from Iowa.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:I am. I'm on a farm in far northwest Iowa.
Nancy Bruscher:Awesome. Thanks for joining us. Darcy connected us and I'm so excited to get to chat with you today. Well, you too, thanks for having me. If someone doesn't know who you are, can you give three words or phrases to describe yourself?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:So I am a writer. I'm an author of several books, including Growing Slow. It's All Under Control. The Happiness Stare are a few of them. I've been writing for a really long time. I actually started writing newspaper articles when I was 16 years old and I had a career in news before we moved to the farm and then I started a blog in 2009,. And I started writing books in 2014. So I've written a couple Bible studies and a guided journal, and as a part of my writing career, I spend a lot of weekends away from the farm and I travel around the US and Canada speaking to women's events, christian women events, usually on the themes of something that's in my book. So that's one thing is writer.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And now, if we're going to get into personality characteristics, one word that came to mind was encourager. I spend every day online encouraging women in their faith walk on my Facebook and my Instagram. Both of those accounts are Jennifer Dukes Lee on Facebook and Instagram, and of course, that's what I do in my books as well, and also in my ministry out and about in the world. I love to remind people of God's hope and his work in their lives and his faithfulness over time, and it is a joy of mine to just encourage people where they are in their journey, wherever that happens to be, especially women who are going through a particularly hard circumstance in their life just to kind of be the sort of friend, either in real life or online, who walks alongside them and helps them to hold on, to hope when it seems really hard. So, writer, encourager. And then another word, an adjective that describes me, I think, really well is dedicated. I have goals in my mind for things that I want to achieve in the world with God's help, and sometimes those things seem really big or difficult, but I love just putting one foot in front of the other and being dedicated to the call that God has on my life. So, for instance, writing books is a long journey and it takes a lot of time to put 55 to 65,000 words into a book.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And when I wrote my last book, which will come out next year, I actually walked the entire time I wrote it. I was on my desk treadmill and I wrote. I wrote it was 305 miles is how many miles I walked while writing, which is the distance of going from the Hamptons in Long Island to the steps of the Capitol in Washington DC. Another way of looking at it is from San Diego to Las Vegas, and I use those as an example because number one I got in my mind I'm going to write this particular new book. That was along themes that I hadn't written about before, but I was dedicated and I was also dedicated to walking it out, literally walking out this message, and it was great. It just brought a real energy to my book writing, but also I got my steps in, so it was pretty fun.
Nancy Bruscher:It sounds like a good idea. I was like, oh, that's a great idea to do the desk treadmill. What would you say to someone who does? What happens when you have these goals or these dreams and they don't come true the way you want them to? I'm sure that's happened to you before. What would you say to someone who's listening and feeling that right now?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Well, first thing I'd say is you're not alone. There are very few of us out here in the world who have made some kind of goal and even something that you feel like the Lord has put on your heart, and no matter how much effort and time and prayer and dedication you put into it, it simply did not come to pass. And I guess the encouragement is sometimes you can only see in reverse, even as you look back in the rear view mirror days, months or even years later, that God had an equally good plan, or maybe even a better plan, for you that didn't involve hitting the goals that you had for yourself. It's hard to hear that when you're in the middle of something that you're striving for and feel really strongly about, Really truly.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:These things can only be seen in time after you look back on your life, and sometimes I think there may be moments where we have to wait all the way until heaven to see that God had something better for us. So in those moments I do practice what I preach, just knowing that God loves me and that he is a kind and gracious God and he has great plans that don't always align perfectly with my own, but even if I don't hit my goals as I wanted to. I'm learning something about myself, and I'm learning something about God in the process. Our effort is never wasted. There's always something to be gained, and I think that's true for anybody listening right now as well.
Nancy Bruscher:Thank you for that. Thank you so. Have you always grown up knowing Jesus or, if not, can you share how you became a believer?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Sure, I grew up in the church, very much so. I was baptized in the Methodist Church in Marathon. Very much so. I was baptized in the Methodist Church in Marathon, iowa, not very far from where you grew up.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Marathon and I was confirmed in the faith and I stood in front of my congregation with a white robe and a red carnation and professed my belief in the Lord as an eighth grader. My belief in the Lord as an eighth grader. But by the time that I was a teenager I began to have pretty deep intellectual doubts about the existence of God. As Christians, we believe some pretty outlandish things like the sun standing still, seas partying, people walking out of their own graves and ruining their own funerals. I mean, these kinds of things are hard to grasp and as a child who had a lot of questions side note it's no wonder I became a news reporter. I have to ask questions. But as a child who had a lot of questions, the logic wasn't reconciling with what I was hearing on Sunday or what I was learning in Bible school in the summers. So I don't know that I was really an unbeliever. I would say I was a want-a-believer, because I wanted to believe in who Jesus was. I wanted to believe that he existed. I wanted to believe that he really did die for my sins and that the Easter story is true, that he rose from the grave, and it took me a long time to get to that place. But in those intervening years it was a really dark and difficult time, because it's difficult to walk through life thinking that when you die, that that is the end of things, that there really isn't anything after that, which really messes with your mind and your heart. When you think about your purpose too, it's just like you know what's the point in life. And I lived in that quiet, dark, muddy place for probably most of my 20s quite honestly, dark, muddy place for probably most of my 20s, quite honestly.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:When I was in my late 20s, I was a news reporter at the Des Moines Register and I was often sent on news assignment outside of the city, sometimes locations far away, even outside of Iowa and I would sometimes turn to the AM dial and get onto faith radio programs. During those faith radio programs oftentimes there was an altar call, so some preacher would be giving quite a message, unpacking the scriptures, and at the very end of his program he would give listeners an opportunity to turn their life over to the Lord. And so I did that while I'm driving around and I'm like, okay, am I supposed to feel any different now? And I'm telling you a few days later I'd be back out on the road on a news assignment and I'd give my life to the Lord again. I was like if once is good, 50 or 100 times is even better. So I don't know when it quote took.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:I don't have a simple date that would say to people this is the day I became a believer. I know a couple things. Even when I didn't believe in God, he believed in me. Even when I was faithless, he remained faithful Even when I had given up on faith. God had not given up on me and he was in pursuit of me all of that time and he was using those questions that I had to draw me closer to him. I find it absolutely remarkable that I didn't even used to know if I believed in God, and now he's like the CEO of my ministry as well as my best friend, which just goes to show you like God is just doing things in the background that we have no clue about.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And I think for me, a big piece of my faith journey toward belief was asking the questions. I began to interrogate the Bible in the same way that I interrogated presidential candidates, police chiefs, county commissioners, mayors, and God never freaked out and said no, you can't ask that question or no comment. He always opened the scriptures to these beautiful answers. So I used to be a news reporter and I still am, because I'm a good news news reporter, I am preaching the good news in books and on stages, which I just find again truly remarkable. But no, nancy, I just don't have that neat and tidy little date. All I know is that God was in pursuit and I am a believer and he's changed my life, so much so that I have dedicated my own life toward making sure that other people know about him and what's possible through belief in Jesus and in following him.
Nancy Bruscher:Hmm, that's so good. I do like how everyone's story is different, right, and some people have a very specific time, but I I like how you said that you don't, because that actually makes me anxious. If I'm, if people ask for a specific time that you actually, you know, gave your life to Jesus, I'm like I don't know. I, you know I blessed to grow up knowing about Jesus and I've learned more and grown deeper in my love for him. And you know, my faith has changed and grown and there's so many different little things I can say of okay, this was pretty, you know, meaty. For me, this was really something that grew me in my faith or changed me. But as far as like a specific moment, I don't have that either. So I really resonate with what you're saying.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:I think a lot of people are like that and we might maybe, early in our faith journeys, think I don't have a powerful testimony, but this is this is a powerful testimony to say I have been on a very rocky road toward Jesus and he has walked with me every step of the way. You know, most of us probably don't have a Damascus-style moment where, like Paul did, when he was no longer Saul and had this really direct encounter with the Lord, Some do, and that's so cool. I love those stories, but also I think we need to make space for people whose stories may seem a little bit more ordinary and knowing that God works through those stories just as powerfully as he does the ones that would make front page headlines.
Nancy Bruscher:Right, right, and you are kind of noting towards the name of my podcast Ordinary People, extraordinary Things, and that's why I started this over three years ago, was. You know? I was a history major, I did a lot of oral history and God called me to this podcast and I was like you know, no, I don't have time. But it's really more about fear. Fear of what if I start this and no one listens. And then what am I going to tell people when they say, hey, how's your podcast going? And that's what stopped me for a while. But but then God got over that by having someone come, just like you go to talk at women's events. It was a women's conference that really drew me to to, okay, god is saying to do this, and it really hit me that it needs to be kind of ordinary people and that we all have a story.
Nancy Bruscher:I'm always passionate that everyone has a story to tell, everyone has a testimony, if you want to say it that way. Everyone has a way that God has worked in their lives and that this is really important for us to share the gospel. It's an easy way to share the gospel with people, and so that's been my mission for the last three years is kind of getting more ordinary stories. Now I do have people that have just crazy, extraordinary stories, and those are super fun to listen to as well, but I think it's important that so many of us don't have these really weird, crazy, amazing stories. We're just ordinary people living ordinary lives, but if we're doing it for God, then it's extraordinary.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Absolutely that's holy ground. I mean there's nothing in scripture that says I want you to live this spectacular life. There's a lot in culture that suggests that you know we need to have spectacular homes, spectacular families, spectacular grades, you know spectacular clothes and bodies and host spectacular parties and have spectacular children. And that's so much pressure when really ordinary life, right where we are, is holy ground. I mean you just look back to Jesus' earthly beginning. I mean our Savior was born in a barn, not a palace. He walked around and didn't really have a home and picked the most ordinary people for his disciples and invited ordinary people into his life and went into the homes of ordinary people, sinful people, to encourage and bless and convict them, and I think that is the way of Jesus.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:It's upside down that the thing that seems so ordinary actually is quite extraordinary, because Jesus is a part of it.
Nancy Bruscher:You said that so beautifully. Well, I heard and I can't wait to hear this story is you were in a car accident and a woman helped you and she just gave you so much kindness. Is this a story that you tell sometimes?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:I have rarely told that story. I don't think I've ever talked about it on the hundreds of podcasts that I've been on, to be quite honest. But it's a story that is certainly you know in the recesses of my mind, that I can draw up for you, and I believe I may have mentioned it or you wouldn't know about it. It's certainly in one of my books. I think it's maybe in Growing Slow, but I even don't know what book it's in honestly. No, it's in it's All Under Control. I'm pretty sure it's in the book. It's All Under Control. Anyway, yeah, I'd be happy to share that story and if you have any questions about it, if there's something particularly you want to know.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:But in 2009, I was in an accident. I was on my way to serve at a spiritual retreat in Iowa and when I left home it was in January. It was windy, it was quite cold, there was blowing snow, but everything was still on and nothing was canceled. So I left early to make my way for the retreat, to get there in time, and when I was a mere five or 10 minutes away, I was listening to worship music and I look ahead on the highway and a car is veering into my lane on the highway and I veer off into the ditch. But I am hit on my side because I couldn't get out of its way quickly enough and I spun around, landed in the ditch and I was facing the other way in the ditch and I could not get out of my car. I was trapped inside, the windows were crashed in, the parking brake was into my leg, the airbag had gone off A funny story. I looked at my airbag and you can see here that I love lipstick. I love bright lipstick. My smile not the smile but my lips were on that airbag. I won't forget that moment anytime soon and I remember that even in my pain. I'm like, oh, Jennifer, you and your bright lipstick. But I had a lot of time to think because, man, I was stuck there for what seemed like forever.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Somewhere along the line somebody called 911, the ambulances were there and I began to go into shock and I was very cold. I couldn't again, I couldn't get out. But the wind was blowing in and a woman came down the ditch and I didn't. I hardly saw her, I didn't know her, but she had a skirt on a long skirt and she had a quilt and she held the quilt up to the driver's side window to stop the wind and the snow from coming in on me, and she would have had her arms completely outstretched and her arms up for a very long time, holding that blanket for a very long time, holding that blanket. Meanwhile all of the cold that would have been on me was hitting her with full force.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And again, this woman had on a skirt or a dress, and the reason being she is a part of a Christian group, of a Christian church here that has very conservative views about how women dress. So she was dressed as women in that denomination dress. But despite what would have been a great discomfort to her, she stood there the entire time and I remember having just an awareness of her, of the warmth that she brought me, not only physically from holding that blanket up, but the warmth that she brought my soul due to her kindness. I was never able to thank her because I didn't have a chance to ask who it was. I didn't see her face, I don't know, but I think when you had submitted some questions you referred to her as an angel.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:She was an actual, real person, but she was like angelic to me in that moment and when I look back on it, even now, as I describe it, it's also a picture, a metaphor of what Jesus does for us that when we are in our lowest point, when it feels like things around us are very cold, very dark, when we're stuck and when we're alone, very dark when we're stuck and when we're alone, Jesus comes to that window to hold out his arms, just as he did on the cross, but also to hold his arms out to us in embrace, to keep us warm, to let us know that we're not alone and that he will stay with us until the end.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And for me, the end of that ended with the jaws of life ripping open my car and me being swooped into an ambulance with this woman, just out of the kindness of her heart, having taken care of me. And yeah, it's just a really beautiful picture of what we can do for each other in times of heartache and distress. And, again, it's also just a really beautiful picture of what, ultimately, Jesus did for us.
Nancy Bruscher:Oh, that's an amazing story. I was thinking when you put your hands out. I was thinking of her and Aaron on Moses's arms. Yeah, that's so good, yeah, keeping up his arms so that he could. So if anyone doesn't know, I might be saying it incorrectly. You can.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Aaron and her. You're absolutely right for Moses when they're lifting up his arms, yep.
Nancy Bruscher:Because God said he had to keep them up in order to win the battle. And you know, all day or like a very long time, and he got tired, right.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:That's exactly right.
Nancy Bruscher:Yeah, so Aaron and her came and helped him, and I thought of that, of when you were saying that, about just kindness and just helping someone, and it might seem not like very much, but what a difference that can make.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Absolutely. Yeah, thanks for asking that. That was you know, it's just kind of replaying again in my mind, kind of like those core memories do when they play out like a film in your mind. So thanks for reminding me of that moment.
Nancy Bruscher:Yes, Well, as we wrap up, I always end with three questions, and I think I'm going to start with the. What kindness have you received or given in the last week?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:since we're talking about kindness, you know, some of the kindnesses that we receive are could be seemingly so small, but they make such a difference at just the right time.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:I received a text message along the lines of God brought you to mind, and I just wanted you to know that he cares for you very much, and it was something that my heart needed in that moment. So in that way, it was the kindness of the Lord delivered through a person straight to my heart. At the same time, it was a reminder that being kind to others we don't have to make it be such a big thing, even just asking God. Every morning lay a person on my heart so that I might reach out to them and remind them of your love and kindness toward them, and wait for the Lord to give you a name and then respond. I mean that takes a mere two minutes, I think. Maybe you know out of our day, and just to reach out to somebody and let them know that they're thought of by you, but most of all by God, I mean what a powerful thing. So that really spoke to me in a way that my heart needed and also reminded me that I can do the same for others.
Nancy Bruscher:That's really good. A question that I get asked a lot is how does God talk to you? How do you hear God's voice? And I think if we start by practicing these small prompts that we get in our you know, kind of our head of, oh, I was thinking of Jennifer, oh, I don't need to text her, I don't need to email her, I'm sure she's fine. But if you take that and hey, I'm thinking of you, hey, are you doing all right, I'm praying for you, and then sometimes you'll get a response like you know, wow, I really needed that. Or how'd you know to get in touch with me? And then, as we start to practice that, I believe that that kind of God's voice, if you will becomes clearer to us and oh, yeah, I should do this, oh, I should take this step and that's what I was thinking of when you were talking about. Those are those little prompts that seem, oh, I don't know, I don't know if I have time for that. That's probably not a big deal, but a reminder that they are.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Yeah, they are. And I think that it is a good way to become practiced in listening for the voice of God, because even if you got it wrong, you didn't get it wrong, You're never going to. It's never going to be wrong to spend a few minutes to encourage somebody by picking up the phone and calling them or sending them a message or whatever. But I think that when we hear the voice of God, just not to put pressure on ourselves to think that it has to be audible. I've never heard the audible voice of God. I've heard him in my spirit, inside of me, and I think that the way that we become fluent in the language of God is by reading the words that he gave to us. And when we hear those things in our spirit that are consistent with what we've read in scripture, what we've read in scripture, we can feel confident that we are ourselves in our flesh, in our spirit, carrying out the will of God and having heard his voice correctly. Yeah, thank you for that.
Nancy Bruscher:What are you grateful for?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Well, right now, as you and I record this, it's Holy Week.
Nancy Bruscher:Yes.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And I am so grateful for this week, not only for an empty tomb, which is really cool and really important. I'm grateful for the cross and what that means for us, the cross and what that means for us. And I think it's important not to skip over the pain and the suffering and what Jesus did for us in, you know, kind of jumping forward to that joyful Easter morning, but to spend time and to be grateful for the sacrifice of Jesus.
Nancy Bruscher:So I know that's the super churchy Sunday answer, but that's just the honest truth, especially this week when my mind is so deeply engaged with what God did for us the tomb, but I'm trying to this week, remember what the disciples and his followers and the people who loved him felt like when he actually died and they put him in a tomb, and what they must have felt just it's over and we thought that something different was going to happen, and just kind of remembering that a little bit more.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Yeah.
Nancy Bruscher:What is your favorite Bible verse or story?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Oh, it's like being asked for a favorite child. You know, there is a story at the end of Luke after Christ is risen. This is kind of my life. It's not really a life verse, it's more like a life passage or a life story.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:But they're on the way to Emmaus, these two travelers, and the risen Christ comes up beside them and he starts to unpack the scriptures for them and they're pretty downcast because Jesus was crucified and died and was buried and they don't realize that Jesus has risen from the tomb. They don't realize that Jesus is right now walking beside them, but he continues to walk with them. He's telling some great stories and they're like, hey, you want to come in for dinner? And he's like, yeah, sure. So the risen Christ comes in. They still don't recognize him and they're sitting at the table and Jesus breaks bread and all of a sudden these two travelers have an awareness that, whoa, this was Jesus walking with us this whole time and they look to each other and they said did our heart not burn within us as he walked with us, by the way?
Jennifer Dukes Lee:And for me that is a beautiful picture of what Jesus does for us. This kind of circles back to what we first talked about. I walked a long road when Jesus was walking beside me, sort of unpacking the scriptures for me all those years in my childhood, and I hadn't a clue that he was walking with me that whole time. And I hadn't a clue that he was walking with me that whole time. There came a point where I had what can only be described as a holy heartburn moment. Did my heart not burn within me as he walked with me?
Nancy Bruscher:by the way, the sense that, yeah, Jesus is real and my heart burns within me and my.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:my goal from here on out is to have chronic heartburn, to chronically feel this holy heartburn for him and never to keep it to myself, but to share that burning heart with anybody who's willing to listen.
Nancy Bruscher:That's so good, so good. Well, thank you for being on. Thank you for sharing your story with us. Yes, I'm so excited to see what God's going to do with your. I'm going to air quote ordinary story.
Jennifer Dukes Lee:Great. Thank you Me too.
Nancy Bruscher:Well on Ordinary People, extraordinary Things. Your story is his glory. Thanks so much for listening. If this podcast has encouraged or helped you in any way, I'd be so grateful if you shared it with others. Here are a few simple ways to share Text the episode, link to a friend who could use some hope, share it on your social media and tag us. Leave a quick rating or review. It really helps more people find the podcast. Mention it in a conversation. Word of mouth goes a long way. Thank you for helping spread stories of faith and hope. We'll be back in two weeks with Shauna Goldstein, who shares how to be more intentional yet easily share faith with your kids or kids that are in your life. Until next time, keep sharing your story.